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Photograph: Bonnie Cash/UPI/REX/Shutterstock [View image in fullscreen](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/sep/12/trump-russia-putin-fbi#img-1) Donald Trump speaks in the spin room following his debate with Kamala Harris in Philadelphia on Tuesday. Photograph: Bonnie Cash/UPI/REX/Shutterstock [Donald Trump](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/donaldtrump) This article is more than **1 year old** # Donald Trump a de facto Russian asset, FBI official he fired suggests This article is more than 1 year old Andrew McCabe says Trump-Putin interactions ‘raise questions’, as Harris says Putin would eat Trump ‘for lunch’ [Martin Pengelly](https://www.theguardian.com/profile/martin-pengelly) in Washington Thu 12 Sep 2024 05.00 BST Last modified on Wed 2 Apr 2025 13.38 BST Share [Prefer the Guardian on Google](https://www.google.com/preferences/source?q=theguardian.com) [Donald Trump](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/donaldtrump) can be seen as a Russian asset, though not in the traditional sense of an active agent or a recruited resource, an ex-FBI deputy director who worked under the former US president said. Asked on a podcast if he thought it possible Trump was a Russian asset, Andrew McCabe, who [Trump fired as FBI deputy director](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/mar/16/andrew-mccabe-former-fbi-director-fired-russia-inquiry) in 2018, said: “I do, I do.” He added: “I don’t know that I would characterize it as \[an\] active, recruited, knowing asset in the way that people in the intelligence community think of that term. But I do think that Donald Trump has given us many reasons to question his approach to the Russia problem in the United States, and I think his approach to interacting with [Vladimir Putin](https://www.theguardian.com/world/vladimir-putin), be it phone calls, face-to-face meetings, the things that he has said in public about Putin, all raise significant questions.” McCabe was speaking to the [One Decision podcast](https://www.onedecision.com/podcast), co-hosted by Sir Richard Dearlove, a former head of MI6, the British intelligence service. [Trump refuses to say whether he wants Ukraine to win war against Russia Read more](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/sep/11/us-presidential-debate-donald-trump-ukraine-war) The conversation, in which McCabe also questioned Trump’s attitude to supporting [Ukraine](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ukraine) and [Nato](https://www.theguardian.com/world/nato) in the face of Russian aggression, was recorded before the [debate in Philadelphia on Tuesday](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/video/2024/sep/11/harris-v-trump-highlights-of-the-presidential-debate-video), in which Trump made more controversial comments. Claiming [Russia](https://www.theguardian.com/world/russia) would not have invaded Ukraine had he been president, Trump would not say a Ukrainian victory was in US interests. “I think it’s in the US’s best interest to get this war finished and just get it done,” he said. “Negotiate a deal.” Claiming to have good relationships with Putin and Volodymyr Zelenskiy, the Ukrainian president, Trump falsely said his opponent, [Kamala Harris](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/kamala-harris), failed to avert war through personal talks. The vice-president countered that she had helped “preserve the ability of Zelenskiy and the Ukrainians to fight for their independence. Otherwise, Putin would be sitting in Kyiv with his eyes on the rest of Europe, starting with Poland.” In one of the most memorable lines of the night, Harris added: “And why don’t you tell the 800,000 Polish Americans right here in Pennsylvania how quickly you would give up for the sake of favor and what you think is a friendship with what is known to be a dictator who would eat you for lunch.” [Vladimir Putin manipulated Donald Trump’s ‘ego and insecurities’, book says Read more](https://www.theguardian.com/books/article/2024/aug/21/trump-putin-hr-mcmaster-memoir) The candidates were not asked about [recent indictments](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/sep/04/russia-accused-of-trying-to-influence-us-voters-through-online-campaign) in which the Department of Justice said pro-Trump influencers were paid to advance pro-Russia talking points. McCabe was part of FBI leadership, briefly as acting director, during investigations of Russian interference in the 2016 election and links between Trump and Moscow. Trump fired McCabe in March 2018, two days before he was due to retire. McCabe was then the subject of a criminal investigation, for allegedly lying about a media leak. The investigation was [dropped](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/u-s-closes-case-against-ex-fbi-deputy-director-mccabe-with-no-charges) in 2020. In October 2021, McCabe [settled](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/ex-fbi-official-andrew-mccabe-fired-trump-hours-retirement-will-n1281617) a lawsuit against the justice department. Having written [The Threat](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/feb/12/the-threat-review-andrew-mccabe-fbi-trump), a bestselling memoir, he is now an academic and commentator. Speaking to One Decision, McCabe said: “You have to have some very serious questions about, why is it that Donald Trump … has this fawning sort of admiration for [Vladimir Putin](https://www.theguardian.com/world/vladimir-putin) in a way that no other American president, Republican or Democrat, ever has. “It may just be from a fundamental misunderstanding of this problem set that’s always a problem. That’s always a possibility. And I guess the other end of that spectrum would be that there is some kind of relationship or a desire for a relationship of some sort, be it economic or business oriented, what have you. [Factchecking Trump’s debate claims: from abortion to Project 2025 Read more](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/sep/10/harris-trump-debate-fact-check-updates) “I think those are possibilities. None of them have been proven. But as an intelligence officer, those are the things that you think about.” Saying he had “very serious concerns” about the prospect of a second Trump term, McCabe said he would always be concerned about Russia’s ability to interfere in US affairs. He said: “Their desire to kind of wreak havoc or mischief in our political system is something that’s been going on for years, decades and decades and decades. “Their interest in just simply sowing chaos and division and polarization. If they can do that, it’s a win. If they can actually hurt a candidate they don’t like, or help one that they do like, that’s an even bigger win.” Explore more on these topics - [Donald Trump](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/donaldtrump) - [Vladimir Putin](https://www.theguardian.com/world/vladimir-putin) - [US politics](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/us-politics) - [Russia](https://www.theguardian.com/world/russia) - [US elections 2024](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/us-elections-2024) - [Kamala Harris](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/kamala-harris) - [news](https://www.theguardian.com/tone/news) Share [Reuse this content](https://syndication.theguardian.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fus-news%2F2024%2Fsep%2F12%2Ftrump-russia-putin-fbi&type=article&internalpagecode=us-news/2024/sep/12/trump-russia-putin-fbi "Reuse this content") ### Most viewed - [ Trump warns Tehran ‘more to follow’ after strike destroys Iran’s largest bridge](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/02/trump-warns-tehran-more-to-follow-after-strike-destroys-irans-largest-bridge) - [ Alleged maple syrup scam in Quebec uncovered by Canadian broadcaster](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/apr/02/maple-syrup-scam-quebec-canada) - [ Bodycam footage shows Tiger Woods’s shock after crash: ‘I’m being arrested?’](https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2026/apr/02/tiger-woods-bodycam-footage-dui-arrest-golf) - [ LivePam Bondi says she will ‘continue fighting’ for Trump after president fires her as attorney general - live](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2026/apr/02/trump-white-house-ballroom-republicans-dhs-funding-deal-tariffs-latest-news-updates) - [ ‘A litany of lies’: Trump’s rambling primetime Iran address sparks backlash](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/apr/02/trump-iran-war-address-backlash) ## Related stories ## Related stories -  ### Kamala Harris agrees that Donald Trump is a fascist: ‘Yes, we can say that’ 16 Oct 2024 -  ### Trump secretly gave Putin Covid test machines, Bob Woodward book says 8 Oct 2024 -  ### Harris decries Trump’s ‘proposals of surrender’ as Zelenskyy visits White House 26 Sept 2024 -  ### Advisers worry whether ‘happy Trump’ or ‘angry Trump’ will show up to debate 9 Sept 2024 -  ### Trump supporters ramp up attacks on Tim Walz’s personal history 27 Aug 2024 -  ### Donald Trump threatens to pull out of 10 September presidential debate 26 Aug 2024 -  ### Trump: report FBI investigated him as possible Russian agent is 'insulting' 13 Jan 2019 -  ### Trump back-pedals on Russian meddling remarks after outcry 18 Jul 2018 ## More from News ## More from News -  ### DoctorsStreeting hits out at BMA ‘delusion’ as talks to avert resident doctors’ strike fail 8h ago -  ### Assisted dyingCPS considering 13 suspected cases of assisted dying in England and Wales 4h ago -  ### PoliticsStarmer must call energy summit akin to 2008 crisis response, Labour MP says 7h ago -  ### USTrump fires Pam Bondi, a loyalist and ally, as attorney general 4h ago -  ### UKUK flag-raising group leader arrested on suspicion of causing ‘alarm and distress’ 2h ago -  ### FilmFederal judge throws out most of Blake Lively’s claims against Justin Baldoni 3h ago -  ### LondonSadiq Khan warns of ‘zero-tolerance approach’ to any repeat of Clapham disorder 6h ago -  ### ComedyLouis CK to headline Hollywood Bowl for Netflix festival 4h ago -  ### ScienceArtemis II astronauts prepare to leave Earth’s orbit and head towards the moon 9h ago ## Most viewed ## Most viewed - [Most viewed Across the Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/sep/12/tabs-popular-0) - [Most viewed in US news](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/sep/12/tabs-popular-1) ### Most viewed Across the\ Guardian 1. 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[Donald Trump](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/donaldtrump) can be seen as a Russian asset, though not in the traditional sense of an active agent or a recruited resource, an ex-FBI deputy director who worked under the former US president said. Asked on a podcast if he thought it possible Trump was a Russian asset, Andrew McCabe, who [Trump fired as FBI deputy director](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/mar/16/andrew-mccabe-former-fbi-director-fired-russia-inquiry) in 2018, said: “I do, I do.” He added: “I don’t know that I would characterize it as \[an\] active, recruited, knowing asset in the way that people in the intelligence community think of that term. But I do think that Donald Trump has given us many reasons to question his approach to the Russia problem in the United States, and I think his approach to interacting with [Vladimir Putin](https://www.theguardian.com/world/vladimir-putin), be it phone calls, face-to-face meetings, the things that he has said in public about Putin, all raise significant questions.” McCabe was speaking to the [One Decision podcast](https://www.onedecision.com/podcast), co-hosted by Sir Richard Dearlove, a former head of MI6, the British intelligence service. The conversation, in which McCabe also questioned Trump’s attitude to supporting [Ukraine](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ukraine) and [Nato](https://www.theguardian.com/world/nato) in the face of Russian aggression, was recorded before the [debate in Philadelphia on Tuesday](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/video/2024/sep/11/harris-v-trump-highlights-of-the-presidential-debate-video), in which Trump made more controversial comments. Claiming [Russia](https://www.theguardian.com/world/russia) would not have invaded Ukraine had he been president, Trump would not say a Ukrainian victory was in US interests. “I think it’s in the US’s best interest to get this war finished and just get it done,” he said. “Negotiate a deal.” Claiming to have good relationships with Putin and Volodymyr Zelenskiy, the Ukrainian president, Trump falsely said his opponent, [Kamala Harris](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/kamala-harris), failed to avert war through personal talks. The vice-president countered that she had helped “preserve the ability of Zelenskiy and the Ukrainians to fight for their independence. Otherwise, Putin would be sitting in Kyiv with his eyes on the rest of Europe, starting with Poland.” In one of the most memorable lines of the night, Harris added: “And why don’t you tell the 800,000 Polish Americans right here in Pennsylvania how quickly you would give up for the sake of favor and what you think is a friendship with what is known to be a dictator who would eat you for lunch.” The candidates were not asked about [recent indictments](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/sep/04/russia-accused-of-trying-to-influence-us-voters-through-online-campaign) in which the Department of Justice said pro-Trump influencers were paid to advance pro-Russia talking points. McCabe was part of FBI leadership, briefly as acting director, during investigations of Russian interference in the 2016 election and links between Trump and Moscow. Trump fired McCabe in March 2018, two days before he was due to retire. McCabe was then the subject of a criminal investigation, for allegedly lying about a media leak. The investigation was [dropped](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/u-s-closes-case-against-ex-fbi-deputy-director-mccabe-with-no-charges) in 2020. In October 2021, McCabe [settled](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/ex-fbi-official-andrew-mccabe-fired-trump-hours-retirement-will-n1281617) a lawsuit against the justice department. Having written [The Threat](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/feb/12/the-threat-review-andrew-mccabe-fbi-trump), a bestselling memoir, he is now an academic and commentator. Speaking to One Decision, McCabe said: “You have to have some very serious questions about, why is it that Donald Trump … has this fawning sort of admiration for [Vladimir Putin](https://www.theguardian.com/world/vladimir-putin) in a way that no other American president, Republican or Democrat, ever has. “It may just be from a fundamental misunderstanding of this problem set that’s always a problem. That’s always a possibility. And I guess the other end of that spectrum would be that there is some kind of relationship or a desire for a relationship of some sort, be it economic or business oriented, what have you. “I think those are possibilities. None of them have been proven. But as an intelligence officer, those are the things that you think about.” Saying he had “very serious concerns” about the prospect of a second Trump term, McCabe said he would always be concerned about Russia’s ability to interfere in US affairs. He said: “Their desire to kind of wreak havoc or mischief in our political system is something that’s been going on for years, decades and decades and decades. “Their interest in just simply sowing chaos and division and polarization. If they can do that, it’s a win. If they can actually hurt a candidate they don’t like, or help one that they do like, that’s an even bigger win.”